The Sabbath vs Sun day debate

Calendar Changes

Some point out that the civil calendar was changed in the sixteenth century and that the weekly cycle itself was altered - all over the world - so no one can be certain that Saturday is the true seventh day of the week. Those who use this argument are misinformed. Here are the facts of history: In the year 1582 the Julian calendar (named after the Emperor Julius Caesar) was found to be 10 days late when compared with the position of the sun. That is, the vernal equinox was not occurring on or about March 20/21, as it should do in a correct solar calendar, but was gradually receding towards the beginning of March. The reason for this error was that the Julian calendar worked on the basis that the year was 365 days, 6 hours in length, whereas in truth it is about 11 minutes more than that. Over the centuries this 11 minute discrepancy accumulated causing the Julian calendar to steadily recede, till by the sixteenth century it had lost 10 days and the equinox was occurring on March 11th in that calendar. To correct this discrepancy Pope Gregory X111 ordered that 10 days be added to the Julian calendar dates to bring them into line with the sun. The month of October was chosen for the amendment and in the calendar of 1582 that month appeared as follows: OCTOBER 1582 SunMonTueWedThuFriSat
1 2 3 415 16 171819202122 23 242526272829 30 31

You will notice from the above that the weekly cycle, the order of the days of the week, remained unchanged even though the Gregorian calendar dates had increased by ten between the Thursday 4th and the following day - Friday 15th. In other words in both calendars the day after Thursday remained a Friday. This amendment, understandably, was not very popular in some countries, mainly because it had been authorized by a Roman Catholic Pope. Several Protestant countries refused to acknowledge it and continued to use the Julian calendar; but one by one they came into line. Here is a short list of when they did: Germany (Catholic States)1583 Germany (Protestant States)1700 Netherlands1700 England1752 Rumania, Turkey and Russia1919

All those years between 1582 and 1919 while both calendars were in use, the sequence of the days in the weekly cycle was the same in every country. In other words Sunday in Rome in 1900 was also Sunday in Russia in that year even though both countries were using a different calendar. And as each nation adopted the Gregorian calendar it simply added 10 days to its Julian calendar date. There was no need to change the order of the days of the week, because they already agreed.
Saturday ... Is it the 7th Day of the Week? ... A Voice In The Wilderness - Canada

 

That may be true, but before the Gregorian calendar was the Julian calendar. Before that was the Roman calendar (dated to 45 BC), and before that there is no evidence that the Israelites used any of the aforementioned calendars (which is where ours comes from). The Jewish calendar has remained unchanged since like 1100 AD. Before that, it was constantly changing. To further complicate things, calendars inter-mingled as populations did. I think the best calendar before the Roman calendar was the lunar calendar. We all know how inaccurate a lunar calendar is. The Israelite calendar was lunar based throughout the Old Testament. What is still unknown is the exact astronomical positions and status of the moon on the Sabbath when God rested. Since the Bible doesn't say, we have no way of knowing. The best the old testament gives us in terms of dates is years. Those years are fuzzy at best unless everyone died on their birthdays

Moses was 120 years old when he died. Is that 120 year and three days or did he die on his birthday exactly? Deaths aren't recorded to that accuracy because it simply wasn't important. When we go to count backwards, though, to define when the Sabbath was we can only get within +/- a year/person. That's if we can somehow overlook the blanks in the record where unspecified time elapses.

The Old Testament Calendar is a best guess and offers no certainty.

 

THE WEEKLY CYCLE HAS NEVER CHANGED

I'm no astronomer nor historian or expert in any of these areas Hispeed and I suppose you can make the facts tell any story so I have to rely on the Holy Spirit to guide me
this article and the one linked to this supply some credibility to the 7th day as we know it today

THE WEEKLY CYCLE HAS NEVER CHANGED —​

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The writings of historians, the records of chronographers, the languages of earth, the calendars of time, and the existence of the Jewish race—all testify to the fact that the weekly cycle on our calendars today is the same as in earlier centuries—going back to the time of Christ, to Moses, and beyond.
In the beginning, God gave us the weekly seven-day cycle, with the Sabbath as the last day. That pattern has never changed. The seventh day of the week today is the true Bible Sabbath. Our seventh day is the Sabbath which Jesus kept; it was the Sabbath in the time of Moses when the Ten Commandments were written down. Historians and scientists all agree that this is true.
If there had been any change in the weekly cycle, between the time of Creation and the time of Moses, a correction would have been made when the Ten Commandments were given to the Hebrews. From that time, on down to the present, there have always been Jews to testify as to the true Sabbath. It is the same seventh day of the week which is on our calendars. While all the other ancient races are now intermingled, the Jews have been kept separate so they could testify to the fact that our seventh day is the Bible Sabbath!
The yearly cycle has been changed. In 1582, the length of the year was changed to include the leap year. This changeover resulted in October 1582 having only 21 days! But each week remained the same seven days in length. Thursday, October 4, was followed by Friday, October 15. God has divinely protected the weekly cycle down through the ages. If He had not done this, it would be impossible to keep the Sabbath holy, as He has commanded. But, because He has, we have no excuse not to. The seventh day is a holy day, made holy by the command of God. All calendars agree: The seventh day is the Sabbath. Sunday is the first day; the day called "Saturday" in the English langauge is the Sabbath.
However, in 108 of the 160 languages of mankind, the seventh day is called "the Sabbath"! Did you know that? Dr. William Mead Jones of London prepared a chart proving this. (A copy of this chart can be obtained free of charge from the publisher of this book: Ask for "The Chart of the Week" [BS–28-29]. English is one of the few major languages in which the seventh day is not called "the Sabbath."
Here are ten examples: Hebrew: Shabbath / Greek: Sabbaton / Latin: Sabbatum / Arabic: Assabit / Persian: Shambin / Russian: Subbota / Hindustani: Shamba / French: Samedi / Italian: Sabbato / Spanish: Sabado.
"By calculating the eclipses, it can be proven that no time has been lost and the creation days were seven, divided into 24 hours each."—Dr. Hinkley, The Watchman, July 1926 [Hinkley was a well-known astronomer].
"The human race never lost the septenary [seven day] sequence of week days and that the Sabbath of these latter times comes down to us from Adam, though the ages, without a single lapse."—Dr. Totten, professor of astronomy at Yale University.
"Seven has been the ancient and honored number among the nations of the earth. They have measured their time by weeks from the beginning. The origin of this was the Sabbath of God, as Moses has given the reasons for it in his writings."—Dr. Lyman Coleman.
"There has been no change in our calendar in past centuries that has affected in any way the cycle of the week."—James Robertson, Director American Ephemeris, Navy Department, U.S. Naval Observatory, Washington, D.C., March 12, 1932.
"It can be said with assurance that not a day has been lost since Creation, and all the calendar changes notwithstanding, there has been no break in the weekly cycle."—Dr. Frank Jeffries, Fellow of the Royal Astronomical Society and Research Director of the Royal Observatory, Greenwich, England.
It is remarkable how complete is the Biblical and historical evidence corroborating the fact that the Bible Sabbath was given to us by the God of heaven. Let us keep the Sabbath that Jesus kept! He worshiped on the Bible Sabbath, and never told us to stop keeping it. No one else in the Bible said to either. The seventh day is the Sabbath, for God never changed it.
How very thankful we can be that our God is so reliable. He does not change this way or that. He has a holy law which we must obey. But He sent His only begotten Son to die in order to enable us to do it.
Soon we will be in heaven, and praise Him for His great Gift.
For exciting proof that the weekly cycle comes down to us from the Creation of our world, as described in Genesis 1 and 2 of the Bible, click here on CHART OF THE WEEK.

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Let me relay a story to show you how inaccurate the early calendars were. Anyone that has ever been to a Muslim country during Ramadan can attest to this.

Ramadan is began by the lunar cycle- a crescent shaped moon. The issue with that is that the crescent shaped moon can occur over a period of 1-2 days depending on whom you ask. One village can start today and another tomorrow. Muslims are better about which day now than in past years because communication is better. Despite that, the exact day can vary as much as 24 hours in two places of close proximity. Imagine that sort of inaccuracy at a time when communication took weeks/months, not hours/minutes. To add to this, the lunar cycle is 29.53059 days. We can get that exact today. What the people of the past did was look at the sky and guess where they were in those 29.53059 days they were. They were decent at it- give or take a few days. Can you tell a full moon from a 28.53059-day moon... I doubt it.

Now to the assumptions. Everyone that claims that calendars have remained unchanged since the beginning of time makes assumptions that aren't in the Bible and aren't supported by history. Such an assumption is that early man kept track of time at all. Are there any stories of Adam marking days? No. Any stories of the Sabbath before Exodus (other than God resting on the Sabbath)? No. From Adam to Moses there is no Sabbath keeping. Foreshadowing, yes, but no actual keeping. What about after Moses. Well, I indicated already the issues with trying to track the Sabbath off of Old Testament dating- shaky at best. How did the Israelites know the Sabbath when it was revealed? Its not clear. Maybe they used the Sabbath off the Egyptian calendar they were likely using? Maybe it was chosen 7 days from the revelation of the law? Bottom line, is no one knows.

We can also trace the origin of the word "Sabbath". the earliest account of the word is the 15th day in the Sumerian month. Was it minlging later on with Canaanites or was it a word passed on from the times before the flood? No one can say for sure. How does that affect when we perceive the Sabbath is today? Anyone's guess.

Romans 14:5-6 sums the discussion quite nicely:

So, I will add to this one as well "whenever you set aside rest and praise for the Lord, do so to His glory."

 

IMO, the terms Sunday, Monday etc. are man made, I think it is easier to recognize the sabbath on Sunday but the actual day and schedule is man made. The important thing is to recognize a day as the sabbath.

 

Remember-blessed

however he blessed this day and told us to "remember" it , no other day is mentioned ,it's not our choice it's his instructions

Genesis 2:2-3

2 And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.
Exodus 20

8 “Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is a sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your male or female servant, nor your animals, nor any foreigner residing in your towns. 11 For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

 

Paul, Peter & John on the Sabbath

Jim Staley, I'll search for the complete recording

‪Paul, Peter & John on the Sabbath‬‏ - YouTube

 

Right, God blesses the Sabbath, not Sunday. is that what your saying (I skimmed through the thread)? The calendar and days of the week, work starts Monday, Saturday and Sunday are weekends etc. is all man made. The Bible doesn't Say on Monday God created the heaven and the earth, lol.

I do celebrate it on Sunday though since that's the most convenient day to do it, Church services, no work etc.

 

Droughts-Floods-Fires-Famine

[FONT=&quot]GREEN LEAF IN DROUGHT TIME[/FONT]

Years ago I read a book by the above title. It is a story of the escape of the last C.I.M. missionaries from Communist China, by Isobel Kuhn (1957). The title is taken from Jeremiah 17:5-8. It tells how they were able to continue rejoicing and bearing the fruits of His righteousness in times of great tribulation. I never forgot the lessons they taught. Now you have a chance to learn those lessons as we soon enter the time of great tribulation for mankind and the destruction of the earth. To be forthright, unless you learn these lessons quickly you will die in despair, for only by steadfast faith that continues to praise Him and bear the fruit of righteousness can He protect and deliver.

I'm sharing this letter I received from a dear friend today as I feel it's very timely info for the times we're living in...
My prayers and thanks go out to this dear sister Y. and her timely words and instructions of Abba the Father.

Meat Prices: Cattle futures jumped 23 percent in the past year to $1.1335 a pound yesterday on the Chicago Mercantile Exchange
$1.1 Billion in ND Farm Losses Due to Flooding


Drought Spreads Pain From Florida to Arizona


New York Times July 11 2011


Reduced Crop Yield: The USDA estimated last month that the nation’s production may fall 5.8 percent from a year earlier to 2.08 billion bushelsTexas wildfires cause $20.4 million in losses to agriculture


Bloomberg -- May 24, 2011

Worst Texas Drought in 44 Years Damaging Wheat Crop, Reducing Cattle Herds Below-Normal Rains

Texas Drought 2011: State Endures Driest 7-Month Span On Record - May 9, 2011 The Huffington Post


In an agriculture society, the rain seasons are of supreme importance. Without constant rain, sunshine, gentle breezes, good water and air, and natural fertilizers, the land suffers greatly. If each seventh, sabbatical, year of the land--Shmittah year--is not observed, then the land suffers and eventually rebels. If one fails to obey Yahuweh then the result is drought, crop damage, famine, and nine other prominent judgments, even expulsion from His land. [Leviticus 25:1-22]


My friend, drought is judgment from Yahuweh, no matter how it comes--from His hand directly, or by HAARP electromagnetic pulse waves of “weather warfare”, or some other devious device of evil mankind. All the nations that do not align to His Torah (instructions of righteousness—His Covenant with His people), including Israel, will find themselves in His “ten pattern” of His judgment. Israel keeps passing laws that override the Torah in order to appease the secular Jews, and the international community. They have and are preparing more to break their covenant that Yahuweh made with Abraham, Isaac and Ya’cob, in order to appease Yahuweh’s enemies. When this happens to its fullness and they allow the dividing of their land, the ten pattern of Yahuweh’s judgment will go into effect--in Israel, America, and in other nations that have forced Israel into this position of compromise.
Thus what is happening is that Yahuweh has given the go-ahead in small doses for judgment to hopefully wake-up His people before He has to pour out His wrath full force.




JOEL 1:10-20: “The field is ravished, the ground has mourned, the grain is ruined, the new wine is dried up, the oil has failed. The farmers are ashamed. The vinedressers wail over the wheat and over the barley, for the harvest of the field is destroyed. The vine has dried up and the fig tree droops, pomegranate, also palm and apple trees, all the trees are dried up, because joy has dried up among the sons of men. Gird yourselves and lament…Come lie all night in sackcloth, you attendants of my Elohim. Set apart a fast. Call an assembly, gather the elders, all inhabitants of the land…and cry out to Yahuweh. Alas for the day!-- For the day of Yahuweh is near, and it comes as destruction from the Almighty. Is not the food cut off before our eyes, joy and gladness from the House of Elohim? The seed has rotted under the clods, storehouses are laid waste, granaries are broken down, for the grain has withered. How the beasts moan! The herds of cattle are restless because they have no pasture. The flocks of sheep also perish. I cry to you Yahuweh for fire has consumed the pastures of the wilderness, a flame has set on fire all the fields of the fields. Even the beasts of the fields cry out to You, for the water streams are dried up…”
Here we see the Word from Joel more clearly than ever—the drought brings fires, and harsh winds, add to the spread of the drought conditions and the fires. This is happening in America’s breadbasket because America is forcing Israel to give their good agricultural land to Yahuweh’s enemies.




Deuteronomy 26:2-7. 9: “Guard My Shabbats and reverence My set-apart place. I am Yahuweh. If you walk in My laws and guard My commandments to do them, then I shall I shall give you rain in its season, and the land shall yield its crops and the trees of the field yield their fruit, and your threshing floor shall last ‘til the time of the grape harvest, and the grape harvest shall last until the time of the sowing. And you shall eat your bread until you have enough, and shall dwell in your land safely. And I will give peace in the land and you shall lie down and no one make you afraid. And I shall clear your land of evil beasts, and not let the sword go through your land. And you shall pursue your enemies and they shall fall by the sword before you…And I shall turn to you and make you bear fruit and shall increase you and establish My covenant with you”.


Ezekiel 14:12-14: “And the Word of Yahuweh came to me saying, `son of man, when a land sins against me to commit a tresspass and I stretch out My hand against it and cut off the supply of bread and send scarcity of food on it, and cut off man and beast from it, even though these three men, Noah, Dani’el and Iyob were in it, they would deliver only themselves by their righteousness’, declares the Master Yahuewh”.
In Israel today, the Shmittah years are not observed, so artificial fertilizers and other means to keep the crops going are used--same in the US. The crops are drying up, and famine is near. The world’s food supplies are being methodically and purposely destroyed by “weather warfare” against the people of the earth--floods, drought, high winds, great storms, cyclones and hurricanes, fires and earthquakes, volcanoes, and etc. All are being brought on the food baskets of the earth. The record-breaking historic flooding along the Mississippi this spring (2011), the opening of the levees to food the fields at harvest time this past spring, destroyed many crops ready to be harvested in May-June, again is man-created for destruction. Thus America is very close to famine conditions. To starve the world’s people to death, while the elite have the finest of food stored, is the expressed mandate of the world’s elite “think tanks” of the Lucifer-worshipping intellectuals.

As Israel goes, so goes the nations that try to break the Abraham Covenant, divide His land to His enemies, and put His people in harm. So, as Israel goes, so goes America--the ultimate deceitful enemy of Israel—coming in on a peace platform to accomplish destruction.



***THE WORDS OF HABAKKUK 3:17-19 DURING DAYS OF DROUGHT IN ISRAEL UNDER YAHUWEH’S JUDGMENT: “THOUGH THE FIG TREE DOES NOT BLOSSOM, AND THERE IS NO FRUIT ON THE VINE, THE YIELD OF THE OLIVE HAS FAILED, AND THE FIELDS BROUGHT FORTH NO FOOD. THE FLOCK HAS BEEN CUT OFF FROM THE FOLD, AND THERE IS NO HERD IN THE STALLS. YET I WILL EXALT IN YAHUWEH. I REJOICE IN THE ELOHIM OF MY DELIVERANCE. THE MASTER YAHUWEH IS MY STRENGTH. AND HE MAKES MY FEET LIKE THOSE OF A DEER , AND MAKES ME TO WALK ON MY HIGH PLACES” (of victory).

WILL YOU BE ABLE TO REJOICE LIKE HABAKKUK? You can! All it takes is to “put on the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness”, which comes from resting in faith in the goodness of Yahuweh. It comes from deep within a spirit that knows Him. Isaiah 26:3-4: “The one whose mind is stayed (fixed, centered, unmoving) on You, You guard with perfect peace, for he trusts in You. Trust in Yahuweh forever, for in Yah, Yahuweh, is a rock of ages”. Put the victorious Psalms and other Scriptures of victory so deep in your spirit that you become unshakable in faith, always resorting to praise, rather than fear or despair.
Luke 6:46-49: “Why do you call Me `Master, Master’ and do not do what I say? Everyone who is coming to Me and hearing My words and doing them, I will show you what he is like. He is like a man building a house who dug deep and laid a foundation on a rock. And when the flood came, the stream burst against the house, but was unable to shake it for it was founded on a rock. But, one hearing and not doing is like a man who build his house on the sand, without foundation, against which the steam burst, and immediately it fell. And the ruin of that house was great”.


While there is drought in some places, there is flooding in others. Both can destroy anything that is not strongly protected. Our first line of protection is the new birth, followed by being filled with Yahuweh Spirit. When we receive the blood sacrifice of Yahushua to cleanse us from our sins, and remove us from the kingdom of darkness, and receive His resurrection as our own for eternal life, then we come into transformation by the Spirit called “the new birth”, or being born from above. We immediately are declared “righteous” by Yahuweh and justified--declared just by the Judge of the universe. This is imparted legal righteousness (rightness) based on what Yahushua did, not what we do. But, after this new birth, we must grow up into Him to represent His likeness on earth. To do this we must live a life of humility and repentance, and of praise and rejoicing in Him, reflecting His nature from our re-born spirit--love, joy, peace, longsuffering, patience, kindness, gentleness, and obedience as good servants. To do this, we must be filled with the Spirit, led by the Spirit, and taught by the Spirit. We cannot live this life in our own strength. We must have Him empowering us!!! And, to have our own righteousness, we must guard and do the Covenant of Yahuweh found in His Torah (the teachings and instructions of the Kingdom of heaven for our happiness and good on this earth). We must teach them to our children and to all to whom He sends us.
--
Jeremiah 17:5-8 puts it like this: “…Cursed is the man who trusts in man and makes flesh his arm of support, and whose heart turns away from Yahuweh. For he shall be like a shrub in the desert and shall not see when good comes, but shall inhabit the parched places in the wilderness, a salt land that is not inhabited. Blessed is the man who trusts in Yahuweh and whose trust is Yahuweh. For he shall be like a tree planted by the waters, which spreads out its roots by the river, and does not see when heat comes. AND HIS LEAF SHALL BE GREEN, AND IN THE YEAR OF DROUGHT HE IS NOT ANXIOUS, NOR DOES HE CEASE FROM YIELDING FRUIT”.
His fruitful trees of righteousness must be always about the business of yieldfing fruit, making life changing impacts on the lives of all around us. But, we cannot yield fruit if we are detached from the vine. It is the root, and the vine, which take the goodness throught the system of the plant and bring forth fruit.
From John 15:1-6: Yahushua says it like this: “I am the true vine, and My Father is the gardener. Every branch in Me that bears no fruit, He takes away. And every branch that bears fruit, He prunes so that it bears more fruit…Stay in Me and I stay in you. As the branch is unable to bare fruit of itself unless it stays in the vine, so neither you unless you stay in Me. I AM THE VINE. YOU ARE THE BRANCHES. HE WHO STAYS IN ME AND I IN HIM, HE BEARS MUCH FRUIT. FOR WITHOUT ME YOU ARE ABLE TO DO NOTHING”.



Most of His people have been eating defiled fruit by submitting to defiled teaching from people who do not know Him, all their lives. The only way to get pure undefiled fruit is to anchor your faith deeply in Messiah and into the Word, so that the Word works to purify you from the inside out, transforming you into the image of Messiah and His Abba, Yahuweh. You cannot transform yourself!!! You have to “put the ax to the root of the trees” that you have been eating from, the defiled trees, and then go to the Tree of Life for your food! This means that most of you will have to change teachers! You will have to stop depending on man to spoon feed you, and make the Spirit of Yahuweh exclusivlely your Teacher. Its time to eat spiritual meat, and stop eating the sickening diet of baby cereal fed by man who does not know Yahuweh for himself. Man, who is taught by Yahuweh, can confirm, but only after the Teacher has taught. The wise have the Spirit for their Teacher!!! Fools don’t! Whatever goes in, comes out—whether truth, falsehood, or a mixture of both. If the Spirit is our exclusive Teacher, then the fruit that comes out of us will be pure and good, and bless and hurting world.
A good friend of mine said recently: “THE SEED IS IN THE FRUIT”. If you are fruitful from being rooted and anchored in the vine, Yahushua, then your fruit, and the seed within it will nurture and cause growth in all around you. You will then sow the seed of righteousness, in word and in character and deed, and those around you wll then begin to grow and change by the power of His Spirit, or drop away because their own soil (their lives) is too hard and barren to allow the seed to grow. (See Mark 4:1-20). All we have to do is be fruitful, and the seeds of His Word and righteousness will fall from our lips and our actions, and if the soil is right, then they will grow and produce by His Spirit’s power. We don’t need to nag anyone, or try to play “Holy Spirit” – all we have to do is “be” – let Him bring forth the fruit, and the seeds will then be sown without us having to put on a show to impress anyone. If we speak for Him, it must be directed and controlled by Him exclusively!
We are very near the time of drought, of war, of famine, of pestilence, of massive death worldwide--the great tribulation—but those that keep producing fruit, whose “leaf is green” will be used mightily by Yahuweh to do “exploits”, for they know their Elohim (Daniel 11:32). We are in the time of the “exploit people”. Will you be one of them? Yahuweh is now “pruning” the branches! Soon He will burn the dead branches and trees. Will you submit to His pruning process, so that all sin might be taken from you, so that you will produce the fruit of His righteousness? It is a process of breaking the “self”. It is a process of discipline, of correction, of aligning to His will and saying no to self will. All of those I’ve talked to of the “exploit people” are going through this processing severely. But, they are getting rid of problems within themselves they’ve had all their lives, and getting free to serve Him exclusively.

 

Why Not Ask God about the Sabbath

Guess it really all comes down to "who are we going to follow, God or man?"

Mar 7:6 He replied, "Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written: "'These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me.
Mar 7:7 They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.'
Mar 7:8 You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to the traditions of men."
Mar 7:9 And he said to them: "You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe your own traditions!

Why Not Ask God about the Sabbath

God Answers ALL Questions about Sabbath

 

Modern and Historic Statements about the Sabbath

just a short list of clergy and their take on the Sabbath issue

Modern and Historic Statements about the Sabbath

Baptist
"There was and is a command to keep holy the Sabbath day, but that Sabbath day was not Sunday. It will however be readily said, and with some show of triumph, that the Sabbath was transferred from the seventh to the first day of the week, with all its duties, privileges and sanctions. Earnestly desiring information on this subject, which I have studied for many years, I ask, where can the record of such a transaction be found: Not in the New Testament — absolutely not. There is no scriptural evidence of the change of the Sabbath institution from the seventh to the first day of the week." Dr. E. T. Hiscox, Baptist Manual

Southern Baptist
"The sacred name of the seventh day is Sabbath. This fact is too clear to require argument. Not once did the disciples apply the Sabbath law to the first day of the week, — that folly was left for a later age, nor did they pretend that the first day supplanted the seventh." Joseph Hudson Taylor, The Sabbatic Question, pp. 14-17,41

"The first four commandments set forth man's obligations directly toward God.... But when we keep the first four commandments, we are likely to keep the other six. . . . The fourth commandment sets forth God's claim on man's time and thought.... The six days of labor and the rest on the Sabbath are to be maintained as a witness to God's toil and rest in the creation.... No one of the ten words is of merely racial significance.... The Sabbath was established originally (long before Moses) in no special connection with the Hebrews, but as an institution for all mankind, in commemoration of God's rest after the six days of creation. It was designed for all the descendants of Adam." Adult Quarterly, Southern Baptist Convention series, August 15, 1937.


Complete list and article here
Modern and Historic Statements about the Sabbath

 

Point -----Counterpoint

$100,000 Reward for Bible text!


‪$100,000 Reward for Bible text!‬‏ - YouTube



Re: $100,000 for Bible Text



‪Re: $100,000 for Bible Text‬‏ - YouTube


I found this offer out there if anyone would like to try this one

FOR THIS REASON, I HEREBY OFFER $100,000 TO ANYONE WHO WILL GIVE ME ONE TEXT FROM THE BIBLE THAT PROVES THAT WE SHOULD KEEP SUNDAY THE FIRST DAY OF THE WEEK INSTEAD OE SATURDAY THE SEVENTH DAY. In order to change the day of worship from that which God commanded in Scripture, to any other day, we would need a definite Biblical command of God before attempting such a thing.
<broken link>

 

all i have to say is who kept track of every day since the beginning of time
kept a log of which day what happened exactly and can display a full accurate account of history proving which day is first or last in the week
its not like we have always followed the same calender...
specially since some superstitious fools totally eliminated the 13th moon (month) of every year, changed the new years from winter solstice to over a week later
and ill bet they didnt have leap days 2000 years ago either....lol
so, when you can prove to me which day is last, ill worry about it
for now, i just take 1 day out of 7 to stop in the woods for a bit and say "thanks big dude"

just a lil thought for yas, which do you think makes god happier, that he is worshipped at all or what day its on? or how about the petty childish bickering over what day, id be willing to bet that pisses him off, same as the touting of whos religion is better, aggravating to say the least, i know if i was in his place id go round knockin heads together til a melding of the minds occurred...lol

 

Guilty as charged

 

beast I respect your "freewill" in this matter.I feel I've provided ample proof from scripture that it does matter what day we call Sabbath and what we're to do. Having said that this has no bearing on what day or days you want to worship.It does matter and it will have a huge bearing on conduct in the future.It's all recorded in scripture and in his word. I've provided only scripture and your giving me nothing back but pure ,raw emotions. Show me in scripture where the Sabbath is sun day or any other day and what we're to do on that day and is it set aside you provide me with the same quality scripture and teachings I have provided you.

I don't know anything about who's religion is better since that's not the point of these threads .I was in the dark about this several yrs ago and started asking questions and no one wanted to answer.

Curious ,does it seem logical that when the Messiah returns that with him being our High Priest ,he'll allow the Sabbath to be observed contrary to the way the Father commanded and he observed while he was on earth?

 

I'll tell you what I think here my friend since you asked .

I'd say the "big dude" is really saddened by your total lack of respect and obedience. The Dude is the Almighty that breathed life into this universe and us and he has a name , and it ain't "dude". So you can sling your rocks at me for pointing these things out ,but you better drop to your knees and ask your Creator for his forgiveness

 

Does God want us to keep the Sabbath?

Does God want us to keep the Sabbath?



To figure out if God wants us to keep the Sabbath today, we will answer these five questions:




1. How long did God say we should observe this commandment?

2. Does the New Testament support us keeping this commandment?

3. Why did God want us to keep them in the past?

4. Does the reason of why God wanted us to keep them in the past still apply?

5. Is there any evidence that we will be keeping the Sabbath when Christ returns?


1. How long did God say we should observe this commandment?

Exodus 31:13-17
Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you…Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant. It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.


2. Does the New Testament support us keeping this commandment?

Matthew 24:15-22
When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

There are many places in the scripture where the disciples went into the synagogue on the Sabbath to preach. Most people will say, they were only doing this only to witness to the Jews but they were still meeting on Sundays to have church. Here is a verse to think about…

Acts 13:42-44
And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath. Now when the congregation was broken up, many of the Jews and religious proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas: who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God. And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God

If the Gentile church was meeting on Sunday, then why would the Gentiles be meeting to hear the preaching on the Sabbath and why did the Gentiles ask “that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath”? Why didn’t they just ask them to preach it tomorrow at church?

Acts 1:12
Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.

If the Sabbath was abolished, then there would be no such thing at this time of a “Sabbath day’s journey”.

Also, after Jesus rose from the grave he spent forty days on earth with his disciples and others [Acts 1:3]. In forty days he would have spent at least five end of the week Sabbaths plus the High Sabbath at the end of the days of unleavened bread. During one of these, Jesus could have mentioned to his disciples that this law no longer applies. How do I know he didn’t? Because if they knew that the Sabbath was already abolished, there would have been no debate about the Gentiles and circumcision later in Acts 15.

Acts 20:6-7
And we sailed away from Philippi after the days of unleavened bread, and came unto them to Troas in five days; where we abode seven days. And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow, and continued his speech until midnight.

In the above verses, the disciples were not keeping Sunday. They were actually keeping the Sabbath. If you have a KJV (with added words in italics) you would notice that the word “day” is in italics. Now, get your Strong’s Concordance, and look up the word that was translated as “week” in the above verse. You will notice that the word translated as “week” in the above verse is actually “sabbaton” meaning “Sabbath”. So it should read, “upon the first Sabbath, when the disciples came together”. What is this “first Sabbath”? Well, if you look at verse 6, you will notice that is taking place right after the days of unleavened bread. This is the time where the people would count seven Sabbaths to Pentecost. This was the “first Sabbath”. Many Sunday keepers present the above verses as their absolute proof that we should keep Sunday. I wonder, if they analyzed these verses, if they would start using these verses as “absolute proof” for keeping the Sabbath, or will they hold their tradition over the Bible?


3. Why did God want us to keep the Sabbath in the past?

It was a sign between God and Israel “that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you [Exodus 31:13]

It is “a shadow of things to come” [Colossians 2:16-17] (See The Shadow of the Seventh Day Sabbath)


4. Does the reason of why God wanted us to keep the Sabbath in the past still apply?

As mentioned earlier, one of the reasons that God set up the Seventh day Sabbath was to foreshadow the Millennium reign with Christ. It foreshadowed it when it was created, and since Christ has not returned yet, it still foreshadows it today. So, does it make since that God will abolish the Sabbath if it still points to the return of Christ? If not, then that means the reason of why God wanted us to keep the Sabbath still applies.


5. Is there any evidence that we will be keeping the Sabbath after Christ returns?

Isaiah 66:22-23
For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain. And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

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and where does it say in the bible that the day we call sunday IS the 1st day of the week
for all we know it could really be wednesday
i dont quote scriptures, as far as im concerned man wrote those

 

I don't know what to say beast

Psalm 73:22-24

22 Then I was senseless and ignorant ; I was like a beast before You.

how does one study to show themselves approved

guess there's not much more to say on this subject or others with you my friend.