Shocking - Islam is Encroaching ...

And the ultimate victors of the Crusades were ...?

 

The Muslims. Give that man a ceeeeee-gar.

 

You are looking for an arguement but you are not going to get it here. You can skew facts any way you want, just like statistics and won't change anything. I could care less that you hate an entire religion, I am not too fond of any of them and think they are all equally capable of doing great harm when taken to the extremes. I have several friends that are muslims and I have worked world wide with muslims, jews, christians, atheists, shinto, budist, whatever. When any of them have a hard-on for whatever, they are capable of anything with god de jour on their side.

 

No argument sought, and I am glad none was offered. I am skewing no facts, at all. Let us agree to disagree on the previous details. I do not hate an entire religion. I hate any fascist political ideology, Islam just carries the trappings of a religion, and that is a rock solid, insidious fact.

Individuals are judged based on their merits, in my book. Just so you understand - I myself am of Lebanese descent on my mother's side of the family.

The fact remains if an American soldier killed a child - for no other reason than the child is a Muslim, the world would be in an uproar demanding the soldier's death and reparations from the US for the harm caused. Using the same example - when a Sudanese soldier kills a child because that child is a Christian, no one utters a word, except people like Persecution.org.


In Muslim controlled countries, non-Muslims who reside there are considered "Dhimmis" or protected people. Dhimmis (especially Christians and Jews) are afforded only the rights of second class citizens, paying extra taxes, but nevertheless "protected" by the Islamic regime. The pact listed above, however, demonstrates a significant level of persecution.

Twenty-first century Turkey, for example, practices one such arrangement. Turkey is an overwhelmingly Muslim nation, and it is home to the leading figure of the Eastern Orthodox Church, Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew I. He is rigidly controlled, and consistently denied permission to develop theological education or buildings for the Orthodox Ministry. Even as recently as 1994, the government of Turkey has used explosives in attacks against the Christian church. Similarly, Morocco allows "religious Freedom", yet Christians are jailed for passing out religious literature and for not observing Ramadan. It has only been in the face of highly aggressive international pressure that even the minimal freedoms Christians do possess have been granted.

To equate all of Islam with religious persecution would be a massive overstatement. Yet, they rank among the highest record in committing crimes against humanity. This violence is often committed by groups or individuals, but sometimes governments enforce it.

Want a horrid and very true example of this? Take Sudan in the early 1980's. When the Muslims came into power in 1983, they immediately declared a jihad against the infidel [Christians]. As a result of that jihad to date:

Between 1.5 and 3 million people have been killed. More Sudanese victims of jihad killings than in Rwanda, Bosnia, Somalia, and Kosovo combined.

Fifty thousand (50,000) children of the Dhinka tribe are held as slaves. Their families can buy them back with with cattle or as little as $15.00.

Forced conversion to Islam is governmental policy. The militant Mujahidin (holy warriors) fight alongside governmental forces.

Open preaching or evangelization is illegal and punishable by imprisonment or beating.

In the Nuba Mountain region of south central Sudan, mass graves hold the remains of entire villages. Women and children are held in internment camps, where the women are systematically raped by the Arab soldiers to produce non-Nuba offspring. There are even reports of soldiers crucifying Christians.

Sudan is not an isolated case. Other notable violators of human rights are: Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Turkmenistan, Pakistan, and Uzbeckistan. In every single one of these nations, a Christian who openly worship Jesus may be killed, imprisoned, forced out of work, forced to convert to Islam, and Christian centers for worship are destroyed. This is not the work of a small fringe group of Taliban radicals or Hamas extremists. This is the work of dozens of governments encompassing hundreds of millions of Muslims who justify these acts by the followers of the Qur'ran and the prophet Muhammad.

Muslims were quick to condemn the actions of the 9/11 terrorists, yet they are ominously silent about the less politically offensive, yet no less horrific actions they sometimes openly support in their own communities. If the attacks on the innocent people of New York city were "demonic", surely the offenses against Christians across Africa, the Middle East, and Indonesia are equally "demonic".

In truth, the carnage on September 11, 2001 pales in comparison to what is even now occurring in some nations around the world, in the name of Allah.

 

I'm not looking to argue either, however, you made the statement that the victors write the history (which is true) and that some here are skewing facts (which I missed).

That begs a response and answering is not an argument, as the facts leave nothing to argue about. You are simply mistaken to imply that the Christian Crusaders were the ultimate victors which seemed the thrust of your post (forgive me if I am mistaken).

I have studied the history of the Crusades for many decades with a special focus on the Knights Templar; Knights Hospitaller and the Hashishins (Muslim Assassins) and the history of the Crusades is often misrepresented and the "history" has been revised by the "victors" and accepted as facts by those ignorant of the truth and their sycophants. Ignorance is nothing to be ashamed of, this forum reminds me of my ignorance daily and I've found wisdom in many of your postings and I respect you - so there's no fight.

Mr. Spencer's views are based on the facts, though he hardly touches on the barbarism of the Islamic culture. If you doubt it, I have some beheading videos in the archives that may remind you what we are dealing with.

I hate no religion and feel everyone should be free to worship or not, as they wish, however, Islam accepts no such premise and the so-called religion of the Mohammedans extends far beyond religious concepts and, is in fact, a long established culture bent on a dangerous governmental theocracy that dictates the establishment of a world-wide Caliphate; the destruction, enslavement or conversion of any infidel that does not accept the entirety of their philosophy and beliefs. That all Muslims are not extremist jihadis is a fact as well, but when tshtf, all Muslims will be on the side of mullahs, not the infidels.

At any rate, I'm sorry if you took offense, I didn't mean my comment as an attack and I in no way want to get off to a bad start at this forum. However, no scholar I know of will state that the Christians were the victors of the Crusades (including Muslims), that was my only point and I'm sticking to it. The skewed facts are hardly a matter of debate, only, who's doing the skewing. Best Regards.

 

This spells it out very well. I find Gates of Vienna an excellent source that has many links to like minded sites.

Gates of Vienna: The Art of Strategic Citizenship

jim

 

Minuteman said it well. I am so tired of chasing scapegoats while the wolf steals our children.

 

That's understandable. There's no doubt that some Muslims are upstanding and exemplary citizens, just as it's undeniable that the US has serious internal problems, but that's another topic on dozens of other threads and perhaps the Crusades, Islamic extremism vs. nice Muslims are off-topic as well. Certainly Images of masked terrorists reading from the Koran behind Western hostages before removing their heads was over-the-top, but, the Nick Berg video and others are constant reminders of "the Prophet's" admonitions to adherents of Islam and shouldn't be ignored. The bombing of the Marine barracks in Beirut, the USS Cole in Aden, Pan Am Flight 103, the World Trade Center and countless other attacks and failed attempts pretty much lead me to the conclusion that something about Islam is a threat. With all that in mind, as well as 600 hundred years of Islamic power grabs, I responded to the "skewed facts" accusation in a post that actually skewed facts and I regret taking the topic further from the original post.

That Muslims are out-breeding other demographics across the globe and engaged in the largest mass immigration in the history of the planet was the kick-off of this topic and perhaps we should keep our discussion on track. IMO, the trend is alarming and even more alarming is that just discussing it and offering opinions can get you pegged a racist or a nut-ball.

That our courts are even considering Sharia law as an option for Muslims in our country is something I find alarming. I've seen the unthinkable become the new normal far too many times and the process has accelerated to the point that it's impossible to keep up with all the new "rights" that various special interests groups are awarded while the average Joe is watching his freedoms going down the drain.

The United States was founded on religious freedoms, but those very freedoms are spelled out as "endowed by our Creator", not granted by any Government or Religion. Islam's Sharia law is similar in that it is represented as "God's Law", but it is vastly different from the western concept of freedoms. The idea that any Muslim does not accept the premise of the Koran is ludicrous. The Koran opens with Fatiha, a short prayer that culminates with, "Guide us in the straight path, the path of those whom Thou hast blessed, not of those against whom Thou art wrathful nor of those who are astray." Islam is the originator of "If you aren't with us, you're against us" mentality and considers non-Muslims sub-human to be converted, exterminated or enslaved. That is not religious freedom imnsho,and it is a real threat to the very concept of liberty. If that culture infiltrates, invades and eventually topples our admittedly flawed system the inevitable result is unthinkable - but the unthinkable is the new norm. My 2¢. YMMV

 

A little tidbit from Drudge that supports the original post,

Austria: Judge Rules That Yodeling Offends Muslims - Politics & Gov't - Israel News - Israel National News

 

I'm thinkin' Drumbo is the one who nailed it. Good post.

 

As an example of special rights gone insane, has anyone else noticed that while Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. can't be bothered to prosecute Black Panthers who were video-taped intimidating voters at the polls with nightsticks, or figure a way to serve an injunction or prosecute Wiki-Leaks for dumping highly classified doccuments these past six months, he has used our tax money to file a DOJ lawsuit against a suburban Chicago school district last Monday for denying a Muslim middle school teacher unpaid leave to make a three week hajj pilgrimage to Mecca durring the school session? The lawsuit demands the district to reinstate the woman (who made the choice to resign in 2008) with back pay as-well-as pay compensatory damages.

Justice Department Sues School for Refusing to OK Teacher's Pilgrimage to Mecca - FoxNews.com

The last time I checked, the hajj lasts 4 days, yet this woman wanted three weeks off (only to return in time to take her paid Christmas ... er, can't say Christmas in Chicago ... Winter holiday leave).
The last time I checked, Chicago teachers are public employees under union contracts that have a clear leave policy, including working only 9.5 months of the year.
The last time I checked, Islam is not the State protected religion in America.

If this doesn't illustrate how Muslims are gaming our system from within, I give up.

 

It is being gamed by Muslims to the end of instituting Shari'a in the USA. Shari'a is Islam and Islam is Shari's the two are inseparable. We are fighting a war on 2 fronts with illegal immigration - the first front is the drain on our tax system by all illegals, regardless of creed, color, national origin. If you want a very accurate and scary idea of what happens to a country when Shari'a and Islam begin to overwhelm a countries inner workings, politically and socially, take a look at any European country, especially England, Germany, and France.

Minuteman, you are not a true resident in an Islamic country, you are a visitor. Islam has very distinct and delineated ways of treating visitors versus the way they treat actual non-Mulsim (Dhimmi) residents. Take a look at websites like persecution.org and Jihadwatch.com.

Also to address the enemy within -you are absolutely right. The Muslims and the Liberals have the same common enemy - Conservative Americans. Once they are able to suppress the conservative voice, the Muslims will turn on the Liberals just as fast. The really ironic thing is, should America become "Islamicized", the Liberals in this country will suffer a far worse fate than the Conservatives.

I love this video. It is concise and to the point, and supported by facts.
YouTube - Three Facts About Islam