Preparedness with gold and silver coins

and also with the caveat that more than one person has the items i wish to barter for, which usually will be the case. we're talking chicken eggs, not a heart shunt.

i feel there is a greater possibility that they will need .22lr ammo more than they will need a silver quarter.

i read your post once...that's plenty.

i get your point, historically currency has been used in STABLE civilizations, but i don't think i'd consider your example a stable civilization. reading history texts for solutions in a situation like that would be like a guy with a bicycle reading a chilton's manual. which do you personally posses more of...ammo or silver coins?

 

In numbers, ammo. In total value of FRNs, silver and gold coins.

 

Jonas,

As an unofficial question, do you see any fault with a plan to purchase one 20 coin roll of Walking Liberties per month? Coin dollar cost averaging??? Mny thanks, Overbore

 

I look at it this way, maybe not #1 or 2 but gold and silver pieces have there place in a major SHTF situation or TEOTWAWKI. Katrina was a SHTF situation that G&S wouldn't do much. Obviously food and the procurement (guns ammo fishing gea, filters)of food and water #1, shelter, security#2, sanitation #3, tools, repair items#4, energy, precious metals, female companionship, vehicles. Maybe topic for new discussion, barter items and rank of importance.

We have all been stocking up, some more than others. There may be the situation that you need something from someone who has their needs taken care of. Every barter item e.g. toilet paper, ammo, food etc he already has. Well he may want gold for what you need. You can speculate other siutations, worst case, hostage, war lords, maybe gold would work. It sounds F'd up but women will be a commodity as well.

 

A roll of walking liberties has the same silver content as a roll of pre-1965 Kennedys or Franklin halves. You're looking at $10 FRN face, or roughly $130 FRNs for the roll. A roll of pre-65 Washington quarters is also $10 FRN face, as are 2 rolls of pre-1965 Roosevelt dimes. Don't forget 1942-1945 Jefferson "war nickels" which are 35% silver and usually can be had under spot with a bit of looking.

Actually, I think you're better of setting X FRNs per month aside, then use them to buy whatever 90% pre-1965 US silver coinage is available. Dimes, quarters, halves, makes no never-mind which. Just remember, the name of the game is to buy as many troy ounces of silver as possible for your money in a form "Joe Six-Pack" will easily recognize. In a post-SHTF or post-TEOTWAWKI situation, once recovery begins, the true value of "real money" will be appreciated.

I've had good luck on eBay buying small lots (10-12 coins plus shipping) at a total cost that's under current melt price but I'm retired and have the time to do the hunting. So far, I have had only two problems with sellers, which were both quickly resolved within 24 hours.

It also never hurts to go to your local coin dealer and ask what he has for sale under spot price. You'd be surprised at the stuff that you can occasionally pick up from a coin store that's trying to get rid of the odds and ends of an estate collection. It helps if you know the current spot price and melt value of coins before you walk in the door though.

If you want to know the current spot price of gold and silver, download and install this neat little program which will display the current spot prices in your status bar:
http://kcast.kitco.com/

You can also get the current melt value of US and Canadian coins here:
http://www.coinflation.com/silver_coin_values.html

Finally, I've got a couple of Excel spreadsheets which compute the value of US silver coinage and helps keep a running inventory of my coins. I'll be more than happy to send these to anyone who wants them if they'll PM me their e-mail address.

 

Interesting reading.. I can't afford gold and silver anymore so I have been stocking up on lead and copper.. (bullets/loaded ammo) I honestly wonder what will have the most value in a SHTF situation?.... I can definitely see plenty of theft and looting happening.. jeez, its happening right now just over the price of fuel.. imagine NO fuel, food, heat, clothes fresh water etc?... here in Oregon it gets pretty cold in the winter.. how far are you willing to go just to protect your woodpile?.. and even further, what would wood cost you if you needed it?
I think the whole SHTF concept goes far beyond gold and silver.. the question is how would you defend what you need to simply stay alive?..
All of this is hypothetical of course, just my rambling thoughts.

 

....

 

Jonas,

E-mail me <gca747@bellsouth.net> , please Many thanks, Overbore

 

Overbore, Please PM me your e-mail address again. I must have lost it. Thanks. JP

 

Jonas,

Gone Completely Ape 747@bellsouth.net;or gca747@bellsouth.net

Overbore

 

People of the Western world Have ALWAYS put an exorbitant value on Gold and Silver. Maybe because we like shiny things that are heavy.

Remember the Aztecs loved turquise and Jade, as did almost all the NA natives.
The africans loved both salt and gold and diamonds.

So who knows.

 

Interesting aspects on the gold and silver. Either way, does it hurt to have some about? never. I know quite a few people, particularly when they are traveling overseas into areas that are not exactly stable they always take a couple ounces of small denomination gold coins with them for "situations" should they arise.
Someone made the correct post that if things got to be so bad that we are living in a madmax style world yeah the stuff is pretty useless. At that point paper money would only be good for burning. But the fact is will it always be that bad? and would things recover...well the answer is yes.
After any correction in population after any disaster things recover, communities and stabilization would happen, as well as systems of trade.

On the bigger scale of things, and one of the things that gold has been useful for thought out history is if things are bad in one place in the world, you pack up your easy to transport wealth and things and settle down in an area that is better for you. If an economy collapsed and that currency was worthless. Your gold silver could be converted anywhere, just as other goods, Milk, butter, grains, guns etc. they all have a "value" of one degree or another.

Look at American currency, We used Mostly Spanish and British money legally up until what the 1840s Then it was pulled and used to make US currency. Same stuff, different look. And hedged against inflation.
Should the value of the dollar drop to the same value as the mid 1940s German Mark. Its hard to envision the green money we are so used to as being worthless but what happens when it is looked at the same way we look at monopoly money, or if I haded you a xerox of a dollar. would you take it? But what about a handful of gold coins? Next to the stack of xeroxed copies and the pile of gold I think anyone would make the "right" choice.
getting gold is not that hard either, I found a place that has some for sale pretty cheap and picked some up www.enviromintcoins.com Kinda strange as all the stuff they have is from recycled gold but I think its kinda cool. Small mint that is pretty new but seems good. I got an ounce in 1/10th coins and it was only $5 per coin over melt! not bad for .999, best yet each coin has a denomination of $100 each. rather appropriate considering the price. hell I could spend em and make money for what I got em for!

 

IMHO, PMs are like most anything else, good in moderation. NOTHING will provide for your survival on its own. If you ONLY stock up on guns and ammo then the only ways for those to provide for you is through raiding which will by odds have you dead in short order or by tradeing them off which will only last so long before you run out then starve. If you ONLY stock food and water you will likely loose it to raiders/looters. If you ONLY stock up on PMs you are likely to starve or die of dehydration in the imediate time when noone else has it to trade for any cost. Same goes for anything else. Now I personaly figure that the guns, ammo, food, water, shelter, sundry items and such are more 'basic' and come FIRST but then once you have a good handle on the basics THEN PMs are an excelent thing. Personaly I would stock up on nonPM trade goods just as much untill I had a good dep stock of them then likely switch over to just PMs and maintaining stock levels from there.

I figure that the PMs are about the best INVESTMENT around and one that could well carry over into a post SHTF/TEOTWAWKI world, I DONT consider survival supplies as investments though. Survival preps arent bought (in my case) for selling later or to hold wealth, its stuff to get me and mine through bad times. The investments, be it saveings, 401ks, PMs, barter goods or whatever are to have something for a later time to be able to buy other stuff. For investment purposes I personaly figure that enouph money in a saveings account to float the bills 2-3 months or cover a sudden emergency like auto crapping out, then whats convenient and affordable to store in the way of hard barter items (extra nails, soap,excess ammo, etc) and then have the actual investment monies in PMs would be an excelent idea. PMs dont tend to become worth fewer FRNs as time goes by (especialy not in any significant way or long term) but if the money is in saveings or most other forms that are low risk then it rarely keps up with inflation let alone outpaces it. If TSHTF then if/when things recover the PMs will almost certainly retain their value where bearer bonds or Wallmart stocks wont. Depending on if its local, regional, national or global, PMs may get you out of the situation since at present there is scarcely anyplace in the world where PMs dont have value so boarder guards could likely be bribed to let you through if you have a fist full of gold but if our economy collapsed then a fist full of FRNs wouldnt get it done (like if you tried to use Confederate printed money after the civil war). Then there is also the factor that IF you have already stocked up on all the day to day stuff and then still need something you are most likely to be getting it from someone who was even beter preped than you. So if they dont need food, guns, ammo and such (they already have a warehouse stocked with it which is why you went to them to find what you dont have) then they basicly dont NEED anything and are in the same situation the wealthy have always been, the only thing the peons can provide for them is distractions, entertainment and vanity stuff, so even if PMs dont have a use type value they are still pretty and even then would be a symbol of status if they had enouph resources to waste on such things so they could use it to guild their ARs or to make pretty stuff.

I figure that as long as people have been able to figure out how to get it out of the ground they have liked PMs if for nothing more than adornment and a status symbol and dont see that ever changeing in any situation for the folks with all their needs met and those with THEIR needs met are generaly the ones who have what everyone wants/needs. So even in a post TEOTWAWKI era I figure it would be the best option for an investment to hold. Like I say though, do it AFTER covering your true needs and ALSO store how ever much can be convinently stored in the way of barter goods like the cheap knives, spare lighters and fire sources, ammo way beyond any amount you figure you would ever use, etc.

Of coarse the best thing on PMs as in investment IMO is what is most comonly forgoten on survival boards. Prepare for nothing! Be prepared for absolutely nothing to change as well as the end of the world. Might kind of suck to not be able to retire at 70 because you have $250k worth of nails, .22 ammo, soap and other barter goods stored up and things are still just peachy keen instead of $5k in barter goods and $245K in PMs.

SO far I havent gotten the basic needs covered well enouph to have disposable or investable income and so havent gotten into PMs as anything resembeling a priority yet. I figure AFTER I get my land paid of, house built, minimum 2-3 years food stored, farm set up in a self sustaining manner, various other needs taken care of (includeing some barter goods) and enouph in saveings to carry through for 6 months to a year then most any income not spent on day to day stuff will go into PMs and as that goal simply gets closer I will most likely start more actively procureing some here and there. For now its mostly just checking coins that pass through my pocket and pulling any PMs aside and the occasional trade done for PMs to set aside with a total face value so far that at face probably wouldnt buy a decent meal.

 

Thanks for posting about this.

 

This is a post from early LAST YEAR. A lot has changed since then.
Instead of precious metals, I recommend buying durable goods-tools, long-term storage foods, firearms and ammunition, the stuff you would want in a post SHTF situation. You can't eat PM, and it will be tough to barter for food. If you are wealthy, then some PM in addition to all the other stuff might be useful, because the economy will get going again sooner or later.

 

Must disagree.

Accounts from Bosnia, Argintina, all over the world say differently.

Diversification is good.
(And I'd not buy PM's at these prices)
JMHO

 

I bet Tina Turner would have taken a chunk of gold as trade for Max's vehicle instead of taking out blaster.

That's the problem, "at these prices" are these Low's or High's? will gold goto $2k maybe $5k as some have said? If it does then now is the time to buy. Or are these bubble prices? will we see gold $300 again? With India buying a large chunk, china allwoing it's sheep to buy and the UN minting gold bullion. I think the price is going to go up. It does hurt having to drop $1200 for an ounce of gold but ya just got to hope next year it's $2k all speculation.

Silver on the other hand has stayed in the $15-20 range. not so bad. ~$100 a month for 5 ounces of silver.

What sucks is, ok you "invest" in PM's . SHTF doesn't happen before you need to cash them in. No dealer will give you spot price. You will be lucky to get 70-80% of spot. So you have to hope that if you buy an Oz of silver at $17 it makes it to $25 so when you sell you can get 70% of $25 or $17.5 a 2.9% profit, barely inflation.

 

Those countries do not have anywhere near the number of large cities that the US has. Their cities are surrounded by agricultural land. How much agricultural land is around NYC? Boston? There is some around the midwestern cities and southern cities, but just how far do you think that will go in a crisis?
You have no idea how much of the food sold in the US comes from Mexico and South America, it's scary to think of being dependent on them for our food.
Just how much food do you think is produced in our cities?
In a crisis, I guarantee you that people with food stored will not be foolish enough to trade food for PM, they will keep the food for their own use.

There might possibly be a farmer nearby willing to trade what he has grown for some PM, but how far do you think he will get trying to go into a city of starving people with a cartload of food before he is over run and the food taken? You will be better off buying and storing the stuff you will need now instead of trying to trade PM for it later.

 

I'm saving T.P.!
Cases and cases of the stuff!

 

^^ that's not a bad idea, unless you like using leaves and pine cones!