Multi Caliber Platforms

Hey if you have a class 3 and can mess with that stuff might as well tinker right ? I bet you can buy a cheapie lathe (small) and a cheapie milling unit at harborfreight for under 1500 for both. If you have access to a bigger shop unit even better. Maybe you stumbled on something the market needs. Dunno about the silencer part but a universal cartridge insert for different calibers for smoothbore shotguns. Hmm.....

 

you don't have to be a SOT to fabricate a suppressor; just fill out the paper ahead of time and pay the tax.

 

Might be realy cool also if had the stuf to make them to make an insert that would be set up to slide inside of other inserts. Basicly make it so you could have say a 12 ga and the outside of the insert would fit the walls of that and convert it to sa 20 guage then have say a .45/.410 insert that would fit in the 20 ga insert, .38/.357 insert goes inside that and so on down to the .22. Then you could have something about the size/weight of a 10" solid pipe that would allow the 12 guage to shoot all the common caliburs you chose, just pull out the ones smaller than what you want to use and slide it in to use it.

 

How heavy do you think that would get?

It could be awful useful though..........the idea does have some merit.

phishi

 

I think this is a good idea. It could work well IMHO in a break action shotgun. There would be the problems though for a DIYer. To drill a gun barrel with any trueness you need a gun drill. A gun drill is a big piece of equipment that most small ie...local machine shops are not likely to have. In my 10+ years as a machinest I worked in 2 shops that had a gun drill (I worked in alot of different shops). With a regular twist drill and drill press/or lathe the drill will wander and your accuracy will go down the tubes. Then of course you would want the different pipes to be rifled a home rifleling machine is not to hard to build (that in my opinion would be the easyist of the problems to fix). Another problem would be that the seperate tubes would have to fit together fairly tight or accuracy would go down as well. Then you have the problem of if the tubes are that tight changing calibers could be slow not only do to the tightness but the exspansion of the metal from the heat of shooting it.

OGM

 

If I understand what you are saying I agree to some extent but you have to remmber that by adding the tubes you would be adding streagth to the barrel. The action it's self I think that it could take it due to the fact that companies like H&R sell barrels that can be put on sepperatly to shot rifle rounds or shotgun on the same action.

I deffently would not want to make the tubes out of something like cold rolled steel though. I'm not sure what type of metal that most companies make their barrels out of but I would be finding out before I started a project like that.

OGM

 

I figured it would take a reasonably equiped and likely specialty equiped machine shop, but think it could be very cool to have. I figure if it was say 10" by 3/4"od (the ID of a 12 guage) then it would probably be around 3-5 lbsfor the whole thing since it would be one inside another with the .22 or possibly .17 hmr as the inner one so it couldnt weith any more (or actualy a bit less due to the minute gape between the sleeves) than a pipe of that material 10" longx3/4" OD with a .17" or .22" hole bored out of the center.

I dont figure anything like this would be great to take one shot at something with one cal then drop in a different cal for the next shot imediately after, but basicly just that you could change cal with no tools and a few seconds time when it was cooled like say before going out to hunt a particular game or when packing a particular ammo then when the prey changes or the load out of ammo changes you switch the inserts used.

 

MM

I think it could be done. It would not be cheap, to get all the machining done. Accuracy could be an issue but I beleive that it would be reasonable, it wouldn't be a tac driver for sure. I think that accuracy would be improved by making indiviual tubes that would go in the barrel instead of going inside of each other but that would be much more weight and bulk to pack. If you went down to a rim fire you would have to have enough metal to off set the shell so the fireing pin would hit properly, so you would likely want that tube to go in only one way so you could know you could keep some accuracy.

OGM

 

Yeah I figure if you get into something like that then you would be sacrificeing some accuracy for adaptability but figure if it could be done and keep acuracy to minute of deer at say 100-150 yards then it would allow more versatility and be adequate for general meat geting since most smaller game is generaly taken at closer ranges so the same MOA accuracies should still hit most of what you would shoot at if its capable of say 6-8MOA accuracy.

 

A buddy of mine works in a machine shop down here the next time I see him I'll try to remmeber to run it past him and see what he thinks. I don't know if the shop he works in has a gun drill or not, but I know he does stuff on the side. We have a 20ga. H&R. We may just find out how well this will work. #&!! I think I'll just e-mail him and see what he thinks.

OGM

 

Cool, if it gets made let us know, definatly would be interested in the range report and what the up and downs are as well as maybe the likely cost.

 

One thought did just occure to me. Would these inserts be considered to be 'barrels' under BATFE standards or do they recognize a distinction for inserts and count the barrel they go into as the barrel? If they counted the insert as the barrel then if its under 16" for a rifle (18" for shotties) then you would have to get the tax stamps for them.

I know these folks are selling the inserts that are shorter but just wonder if its just gone under the radar as not a priority since they are for single shots and they could use it against someone as they chose or if there is a distinction.

 

nah, doesn't shorten the barrel. The short barrel issue is to prevent a concealable rifle or shot-gun from being carried. An insert does nothing to shorten the signature.

 

I knew it wouldnt be a logical agrument for it anyway, just wasnt sure about te alphabet boys seeing as they tend to not let logical thought get in the way of their ideas. Probably right though since its a single shot and dont shorten the profile then they probably couldnt AND wouldnt say anything about them.

 

Actually, the BATF DOES consider the manufacture of this insert a SBR in and of it's own right.

I know that when I was going to gunsmithing school, when we cut our first chamber in heavy steel rods, we had to cut them longitudinally in half after we got our grade.

WHY? Because that three or four inch steel rod, that we first drilled from one end to the other to simulate a virgin barrel WAS considered an illegal short rifle barrel. As we HAD first practiced cutting threads and THEN used that to cut the chamber, we literally had a short barrel that THEORETICALLY could be mounted to a receiver.

The guy who makes the inserts? I'm pretty sure he is at least a Class III if not a Class X manufacturer. And I'm ALSO CERTAIN that he has had his designs reviewed by the BATF who 'approved' them. Otherwise HE would be in jail for producing rifle barrels shorter than BATF minimum lengths.

I have NO WISH to get into any kind of an argument. I'm just telling you what I experienced when I got my degree in gunsmithing. Plus what I've learned along the road of BEING a gunsmith, though my wife let me retire early last year. I still keep my hand in it. Hey, it's FUN making things go boom - when YOU want them to.

And what seacowboy is technically correct, if you manufacture your OWN suppressor with the BATF's permission (get that FIRST). If you do this and you no longer want the suppressor, you won't be ABLE to sell it or even GIVE it away until you get your manufacturing license from the BATF. Otherwise, off to the pokey you go.

I used to work for Rocky Mtn Arms in Longmont, Colorado. They are a Class X manufacturer. VERY INTERESTING how the BATF does things. When (if?) you are done using the suppressor, you will have to prove to the BATF that you actually destroyed it. I think if you cut it in half (longitudinally) and send them the two pieces that pretty much covers it.

My boss at RMA literally had to argue with a BATF person who said that .223 and 5.56x45 are DIFFERENT calibers. As he had 'interchanged' them on one of the BATF Class III transfer forms, they were going to send it back to him to 'correct' his error. He FINALLY got to speak to someone else who knew this to be incorrect at the BATF and did not have to resubmit the paper work. But still, it shows how 'screwy' things can get at the BATF.

 

Welcome aboard Wallew, you bring a lot to the table and we appreciate your contribution.

 

I go at this a little differently,I have guns and ammo in different calibers. I have .17 hm2, .22 short,.22 lr, .22 hornet,.22 tcm, .32sw,.32swl,.32 acp,.32hr mag,.327 mag,7.62 nagant,9 mm,.380 acp,.38 special,.357 mag, .40 acp, .44 special,.44 mag,.480 ruger, .45 acp,.45 colt,.243,45-70, 410ga and 12 gauge. I need to get something in .223,.308 and 30-06. I have a .327 mag that shoot .32sw,.32swl,.32acp,.32hr,and .327. This is the way I go about finding something to shoot. I traded for the 7.62 nagant and 1200rds ammo,that’s the only reason I have it,but I can also shoot .32sw,.32swl,and .32hr mag in it also. I also have about 10,000rds .22, 1000rds 9mm,.38 special,.357 mag,.40acp,.45acp,and .45 colt. For the 12 gauge I have 400rds buck and 250 small shot. For the 410 I have small amount buck,slugs and small shot, about maybe 300rds.

 

Chamber adaptors are really nothing new. Mel Tappin wrote about them in Survival Guns. Had one that fit a 30/06 chamber to fire 30 Carbine. IIRC another company makes shotgun shell shrinkers. Adapts from 12 down to 410. However you do have an interesting concept.