Ammo availability - old/odd calibers

So a few years ago I started searching for .25-20 ammunition for a rifle that my son inherited (but I restored LOL). At the time it was hit or miss on finding any and if I did a 50 round box was nearing $100.00.
Even the brass has been hard to come by as the manufacturers of the brass only do these old/odd calibers once in a blue moon.
I did manage to get 2 lots of 25-20 brass recently (50 count each) for less than $100.00 (yes, just the brass). I have been watching the gunbroker auctions on these off an on for a few years and the brass regularly goes for $2.00+ per piece of brass.
I noticed recently more auctions for "new" brass (listed as "new old stock") so on a whim I went to Remington's site and low and behold they have .25-20 86grn rounds available for the low, low price of $147.99 for 50 rounds. OUCH, guess I'll stick with the brass at $2.00 per round and roll my own.
I've been reloading the brass I had when I got the rifle and even with annealing the necks I'm getting 3 or 4 split cases when shooting so new brass is needed.
500 bullets are on the way, still have enough primers and powder to load up over 1k of these rounds (providing I don't use my primers for another caliber).
I love shooting this old rifle, just wish it was more affordable to shoot it more. Now it's just a treat to shoot it a couple of times a year.

 

They are good rifles. I MAY have some ammo around here. If I find it, I will let you know.

 

I honestly have never heard of a .25-20...

 

You're not the first person that's said that. I was told stories about how the rifle was used to feed the family. Not sure I would use it for deer or other large game but that's what it was used for.

 

My Grand Father has a strange Fetish for Odd-Ball Calibers, the more obscure, the better! He also had a "Thing" for orphaned Winchester rifles, especially little lever actions and single shots, or even pump actions! His personal favorite being a nifty little Winchester Lever he restored for Grand Mother, a super slick and lightning fast little carbine chambered in,......................32/20!
Grand Mother took more game with that little Carbine then most men take in a lifetime, for her it was a handy little tool she kept close at hand to defend home and hearth and to put food on the table, I pity the poor dumb Goose who landed near the gardens and proceeded to help himself, BANG, Goose for dinner! As odd as the 32/20 is, it's not as rare as .30 Remington, or 38/55, two others Grand Father seemed to have a serious affection for!

 

Winchester SUPER-X RIFLE .25-20 Winchester 86 grain Jacketed Soft Point Centerfire Rifle Ammunition (ammopeople.com)

 

The only reason I knew about it is an old farmer had one that had been in a house fire. The wood had blistered and the whole thing had boiled in fire dept water. It was as orange as a traffic cone when I got it to restore for him.

Generally, I have a little ammo from the test firing left over after a job and keep it in case another one shows up. Odds of that (after 25 more years) is slim.

Now to find them......

 

Ha, just reminded of a .40-82 WCF I have in the safe! Anybody know much about that cartridge?

 

Count your lucky stars! Honestly, I don't know why people want guns that fire ammo that you can't get! Long ago, I swore that I would NEVER own a gun that used ammo that wasn't commonly available in the USA, and used by the military, police and/or civilians! I get that some people love them...and they are just weird! No ammo = wall hanger!

 

Converting .32-20 might be cheaper. New brass pops up occasionally. Full length size, square the case mouth and chamfer.

Imperial sizing wax will be a great help with any case conversion.

Cartridge case conversion is a survival skill.

 

32-20 brass can be turned into 25-20.
How are you annealing them?
They need to glow red, then size them.
The brass is likely being over sized and over worked when fired. Probably need to gap the dies to the shell holder and not push the shoulder all the way back to factory specs.
I haven't had a 30-30 crack since I started gapping them at 15 thousands.

 

I almost left this as a wall hanger due to it's condition but felt I could bring it back to life, and I did. I had the barrel relined and when that was done I was asked if I wanted to convert it to 32-20 I said no, wanted to keep it the original chambering. The only "problem" i have with the rifle at this time is loading the first round takes some finagling, but after that it works. Don't know why the first round doesn't want to line up correctly but the others in the magazine tube work. I've tried it 1,2,3 and 4 rounds in the tube, it acts the same no matter what.

I know that 32-20 can be formed to 25-20 but that brass when I was looking for it was just as scarce as 25-20 and just as expensive. I see it has come down a bit and more is available, so it is an option. I know that the brass manufactures run these obsolete calibers occasionally so I can get components.

@oil pan 4 so your keeping the shell holder at 15 thou off the die? May have to try that. The brass that was splitting was some old brass I got when I got the rifle, so I figured it was just too old. I remember as a kid pulling apart the rounds and the powder looked like donuts.

@techsar that ammo people sight just forwards to optics planet (which I've never trusted) where it says you can place a backorder, not happening. In my searches I found so many sites that claim to have stock but have sketchy checkout processes that I know to be scams.

I think my next endeavor will be to learn how to cast my own bullets for this rifle, and some of the other calibers I have that I reload for.

 

not the worst idea to cover your azz by looking international - could be the day - VERY soon - that ammo will be the #1 smuggled item into the US >>> good chance if you're NATO ready you'll be OK - even better if you have the "other side" covered as well - good chance China will be stirring the domestic pot by shipping in whatever they can manage ....

and then there's the possibility of UN Blue Helmets being hired by the latest Darkside dictator >>>>

 

How are you annealing it? Most people do it wrong.

 

How I annealed.
I used a socket in my drill to hold the cases and applied heat from a propane torch. I spun the cartridge at a slow speed for about 5 seconds, until I just saw the brass glow, then dropped on to a towel on my bench. I focused the flame on the mid-part of the neck.
Found this video on handloaders bench, starting the video showing the method I used.

 

That guy is saying to do it the incorrect way, only heating it to discoloration which is anywhere from 700 to 900f. Which I have tested and it does nothing unless the brass is very, very hard, like about to crack hard.
If you heat them till they glow red and hold the red glow for at least 2 seconds that should get them to close to dead soft.
I run 6.5 and 8x57 brass in a single pencil torch flame for about 12 seconds. That torch in the video looks like a turbo torch and would heat much faster.

 

I only linked the video to show the method, I may not have let the brass in the heat long enough. I got it to just red, then took the heat off and let it air cool. My next batch I will let it stay red a bit longer. I was concerned about having it too hot for too long.

 

2 seconds at 1,225F should dead soft 70/30 brass. That's not including temperature ramp up and ramp down times, so really one second at 1,225f would probably be enough.

 

And just like that, Midway has some .25-20 in stock as well. Can only order one box. Guess I'll be stocked up on rounds for a while.