Could you thrive/survive in the 1850's?

I don't have my little junk forge any more but that could be remedied, I replaced the forge with late 19th to mid 20th century welding technology and tools.

 

But if push came to shove, and I gave you a bellows and some charcoal, could you still make the magic happen?
I'm coopering my bets OP4.
Other folks can google that later!

 

Not really 1860's, but it you go back to the old ways, you also better remember the old rules of health. Frostbite of fingers, toes, ears. nose, etc if untreated will probably kill you. Body temp too low, hypothermia, if untreated will kill you, Body temp too high, heat stoke or sun stroke, if untreated will kill you. Most crushing injuries if untreated will kill you. Most infections if untreated will kill you. Spoiled food, especially botulism, will kill you. Lack of proper food, calories, vitamins, minerals, etc or exposure to pollutants may well kill you. Lack of water , bad water or untreated water may well kill you. Any organ failure, heart, kidneys, pancreas, lungs, etc, will kill you. Any medical procedure that isn't .completely sterile , child birth, minor surgery, etc, may kill you. Exposure to any major disease that you aren't vaccinated against may kill you, that includes tetanus, rabies, and many Asian and African diseases that modern health procedures have kept out of the USA. TB may well kill you. Intestinal worms, blood parasites, muscle parasites, brain parasites, etc, may well kill you. Some data indicate that even at the present time 1/3 rd of all deaths in the world are due to infections and parasites.

There is a reason that the life expectancy in the 1800 to 1850 period in the USA was 37 years and that was higher than it was in a lot of the rest of the world. There is also very little common knowledge on the tricks that they used to survive under those conditions.

 

Why does one assume if they were born 100 years earlier they would have the same maladies they have today? Environmental and dietary influences would be different. One of my great great grandfathers lived to 102 and only died then because a colt kicked him. We are the sum total of our genetics, environment, diet, opportunities, accidents, etc. But maybe most of all, our choices.

 

The need for prescription medications was one of the big reasons I have worked so hard to get fit so I no longer need them. Fitness and being adjusted to eating less will be a big advantage. Looking at old tintype family pictures, I see no fat people. Hmmm, maybe that's a hint.

It would be tense for awhile here, since only about a third of my neighbors would stay if we had some event that thrust us back in time.
After the mass exodus of non-residents I think we'd largely trade roads for water transportation and wind up with a wide band of abandoned land between the coast and the inland farm communities that survived. Eventually commerce could be established along rivers.

I'm thinking that someone with some imagination and skill could feed themselves making paddles and oars from plastic car bumpers and useless electrical conduit from abandoned homes and businesses. The difference between an event like this and a true 1850's lifestyle is that salvage operations will be huge, and the resources available for a time will be plentiful.

 

Having read through the responses I would like to point out that not everyone in the mid 19th century was a blacksmith nor did everything themselves. I question why some people here feel as if they have to learn every skill. There were many people from that era who thrived/survived based on other skills. Many town storekeepers thrived. Many (most??) town saloon owners thrived. The town barber thrived. The town tailor thrived. There were big cities in 1850 where nearly all of today's trades were practiced...albeit at a different level. I don't see an issue with not knowing every skill. In a SHTF scenario there will be things that you will just learn to live without. And just like in 1850 I will barter things I have and can do for things I need or cannot do.

That said...learning new skills is fun and practical. You can't possibly store enough of everything to last 10, 15, 20 years.

 

No single person can do it all. Choose your community carefully and stockpile as much information as you can so essential skills can be relearned.

 

Yeah I could make tools and repair small items. Even some what successful at heat treatment and tempering.

 

Better the big city than oklahoma...

 

New York City had a population of over 515,000 in 1850. The butchers, the bakers, the teachers, the policemen, the restaurant owners, the accountants, the architects, etc. etc. all managed to thrive with no electricity and probably many of them did not know how to grow their own food or pluck a chicken or even dig a well anymore.

I just seem to get this vibe from this website that everyone seems to think that in a long term SHTF scenario everyone will be on their own and so you need to find some out of the way place, hunker down, and arm up to keep anyone who approaches away from you. The history of society just doesn't indicate that. With the exception of technical progress society then was pretty much just like it is now. The citizens of then lived their normal and in an SHTF scenario, so will the citizens of the future.

 

It may only take one skill that nobody else has to thrive/survive. But which skill is that one? Folks can't take away an education, especially if it's a hands on education. JMHO.

 

If thrust back to 1800 conditions it would take a lot less time to rebuild than it took to build in the first place. We would already know what we need because we have seen and used it and have at least a rough idea of how it works. What took 100 years to build could be replaced in 1/3rd the time or less.

 

I agree with the context but for the purposes of discussion, the last sentence is an example of the vibe I spoke of. What you seem to be saying, perhaps without realizing it, is that there will be "folks" going around trying to take away your goods. There are some people today who do this. Compared to the rest of society the number is statistically very low. Why do many seem to think this number is going to dramatically increase during an SHTF scenario.

To reiterate, I think learning new skills is great and encourage people to do so. But perhaps the greatest skill to learn is living and working within a group of people.

 

Progress is a weird thing, the hammer goes back a long way, but it took almost 5,000 years of use before Deere made a iron plow and a while to put wheels on it so the operator could ride and control it. 1860's had railroads, relatively cheap metal, telegraph, steam boats, and was just the beginnings of the modern world. I read a story about living in New York about 1900. If Joseph, Mary, and Jesus had got off the boat in 1900, they wouldn't have been noticeable different than a lot of the other immigrants and Joseph's carpenter skills would have probably enabled him to find a job in a couple of days. No real major changes in 1900 years in the field Yet very few of us could go back to 1900 and function as a carpenter or wheelwright or blacksmith and find a job in the trades. We would do well as bartenders, merchants, etc, but not in the skilled trades.

 

I'm going to skip the quotes but answer the questions. Everybody thinks they can do better than what has past. DO OVER rules. It shall take even longer than it originally did, but the results could well be the same. What worked then will work again.
Statistically those that shall take all you have and more may be low, but if you are depending on society to punish them for thier transgressions............
It is a rule of nature that the strong prey upon the weak. It takes many years of predation before the weak can settle their petty differences and unite under the common goal of survival. The more mundane the society, the longer it takes to vanquish the wolves.

Working within a group is not the same as dictating to the group. Power and influence shall always be a distraction at the least. JMHO.

 

New York City, as mentioned, had a population of half a million in 1850. The New York City Police Department was created in 1845. A society of hundreds of thousands seemed to have dealt with the criminal element prior to their formation. I simply don't believe in the complete breakdown of society such that everyone will be on their own. Society just won't allow it and history simply shows this to be true. Even London in the second century had 50,000+ people living in it. Clearly that many people weren't all growing their own food, etc. Even in a pre-industrial age the citizens lived their normal doing pretty much the same things as we do today. In an SHTF scenario many unprepared people will die during the initial incident and many more from potential secondary effects. Perhaps I'm naive but I'm confident that society will NOT collapse. It'll take a hit but will recover. I would submit that those who attempt to hunker down on their own will actually be at a disadvantage. As 3M mentioned, no one person can do it all. Even if you put together a group of 40-50 individuals with their own various specialties...what happens as those people grow old and die in a long term scenario? I believe larger groups will succeed in keeping society together. I believe that resiliency is highly underrated.

 

I'm honestly not sure whether I could make it in a paleo-world. What worries me greatly is that I am not sure I would want to make it. Do you know what I mean? Do I have the determination to push through and survive, or will I lose my reason, lay down and die, etc. It's a scary proposition you are offering us here, and it's not fun to stare at the Thing in a serious manner. I'm very grateful for your giving us the opportunity to practice staring this down now rather than later....