pentagon footage bogus?

Re: pentagonfootage bogus?

usmcwife:. I don't know.

I do know: there is recorded radio traffic between the fire marshall and crews; where afireman gets to the 78th floor and reports its not that bad" we can knock it down with two lines".and there are pictures where there are people looking out of holes in the buldings on the involved floors.
I do know: there are organizations of literally hundreds of Professionals( pilots,architechs and engineers)people with Far more inteligence than I , and lots of initials after their names who have questions abo ut the official media driven story..
I do know: the third building to fall (wtc#7 )IS NOT mentioned at all in the final official comittee report.
I do know: from seeing news footage, rescue workers were told to move out(/backup ) "explosives were found in the building."
All I want is a real impartial investigation.I want to see all the fbi confiscated security camera video along the flight path of the pentagon plane..thiscountry is a ghost ofwhat it used to be.
Wecan monitor the entire internet but we can't find one broken down old arab in a cave?????and bin laden is on the fbi's10 most wanted list but he'snot charged with 911. (?) b.s.
I don't know.
but
I want to know.

the1800's fire you discussed was probably a wooden( hardwood?)structure, here we have a steel and glass structure fire of office paper kersosene plastic carpetting,office furniture...

 

Re: pentagonfootage bogus?

Talk to the hostages families?aboutconspiracy?I 'm not picking onyou usmcwife. but
Talk to me... about Norman Minettas' bunker(war room) testimony of the aid coming up to cheney:" Sir the plane is 50 miles out...sir they're 20 minutes out, Sir 10 minutes out..then Sir "does the the order still stand"?.Cheney is said to whip his head around and bark"of course the order stands! Have I told you otherwise?"

I'll grant you I believe Cheney was in the"war room" because he was supposedly in charge of a slew of air defense training "exercises" atleast one of which entailed hijacked airliners crashing into buildings.

Significant because on the 7/7 bus bombings in london they( british police) were running drills of terrorist bus bombings at the exact same stops it actually happened.

Bush and Cheney only"testified" in front of the commission on the grounds there were no cameras ,tape or transcriptions and they would go together (?).This is not two teenage girls headed to the bathroom together. Criminal ?no but weird nonetheless.
And:http://wisdompeacepath.org/page/31
Eassay: The 9/11 Omissions Report and the Bliss of Ignorance

My wakeup call came unexpectedly in 2006 when I was gifted a book, The New Pearl Harbor by David Griffin, endorsed by renowned theologians Rosemary Radford-Ruether, John Cobb and others. Before reading it I was blissfully unaware of a long list of painful questions challenging what we were led to believe about 9/11/01. I'd accepted the official conspiracy theory and had mentioned 9/11 in only one editorial, Bush's "Holy War", which dealt with the litany of lies and deceptions used by this administration and major media to sell us the war on Iraq (935 false statements documented by The Center for Public Integrity). As a combat veteran, they were unconvincing for me because similar lies and deceptions were used to sell us the war on Vietnam.

Griffin's questions suggested a larger set of lies were used to conceal criminal activities of US officials involved with 9/11 events and to distract attention away from major criminal investigations that quietly ended that day. For example, the offices conducting then-Congresswoman Cynthia McKinney's investigation of 2.3 trillion - that's TRILLION - dollars missing at the Pentagon (9/10/01 C-SPAN) were destroyed in the attack on the Pentagon. Evidence relevant to the Security & Exchange Commission (SEC) investigations of Worldcom and Enron - re: the $70 billion electric power swindle in California - was destroyed when Tower # 7, which housed SEC offices, collapsed a few hours after the Twin Towers. Both investigations disappeared.

Today a growing majority of Americans are questioning the official 9/11 story in spite of media intimidation and ridicule. That's partly because Freedom of Information requests and dogged detective work by concerned citizens have unearthed new evidence. At this point, over 200 architects and engineers have cited glaring deficiencies in the official 9/11 story, as has the Professional Pilots Association. Firefighters, survivors, and the families of 9/11 victims have also gone public with compelling testimony available to, but not included in, the 9/11 Commission Report. The Commission was less than independent as the mock testimony of Bush/Cheney demonstrated. The Commission's Executive Director, Philip Zelikow, was a White House insider and key promoter of preemptive war. Additionally, New York Times reporter Philip Shenon revealed that much of the so-called evidence referenced in the final report was derived from torture and later recanted. But it's the Commissions OMISSIONS that are most telling. The collapse of World Trade Center (WTC) Tower # 7 is not mentioned nor is the PBS documentary where the owner tells us why it fell.

The following facts radically undermine the official story. Larry Silverstein, who leased WTC Towers 1, 2 and 7 shortly before 9/11, revealed that Tower # 7 had been "pulled" i.e., demolished by timed explosives ("America Rebuilds," PBS 2002). Additionally, physics Professor Steven Jones of Brigham Young University found traces of explosives on steel fragments at Ground Zero. The Commission noted that the fires weren't hot enough to melt steel and referred to the molten metal at Ground Zero as a "mystery." It's no mystery that demolition explosives like thermite and thermate liquefy steel in under two seconds, causing a building to fall into its basement at near free-fall speed, just like #7 did. The Twin Towers, too, fell at almost free-fall speed. These towers were uniquely designed to withstand a direct hit from a 707 jetliner, the largest aircraft at the time of their construction. They were reinforced with unusually massive steel columns at the center and interlocking grids of steel throughout. We all witnessed how well the twin towers absorbed those hits but, as the relatively small fires died down, a series of explosions occurred – large enough to leave seismic recordings at Columbia University. William Rodriguez, a 20 year employee and the last one out alive, reports being rocked by explosions from the twin towers' sub-basement PRIOR to the collapse. Firefighters also reported those explosions. In controlled demolitions the basement is blown first to make room for the neat pile of pulverized rubble that follows. Pancaking doesn't pulverize concrete, steel, or human bodies. It's exponentially slower in collapse time and the end product is a high pile of flooring slabs. With these specially designed and constructed towers, the massive center columns would still have been intact as demonstrated by the computer model shown on a PBS documentary. When viewing news coverage at Ground Zero we could see what was left of those massive steel columns. They were cut at an angle with clear traces of molten metal along the seam – exactly what one would expect from shape-charge explosives and a standard demolition as Mr Silverstein revealed.

The documentary 9/11 Mysteries.com brings many more facts to light, but the above are enough to warrant a real investigation. The question is: how do we make it happen? Supporting Dennis Kucinich's impeachment probe of the Vice President is a logical starting point. Former Transportation Secretary, Norman Minetta, sacrificed his career when informing us that Dick Cheney had a hand in standing down defenses that day and allowing the Pentagon to be hit. It was a lucky strike for his former boss, Donald Rumsfeld, and others involved in the $2.3 trillion scandal; and a lucky day for those who had long planned and pushed for unprovoked attacks on Iraq, Iran, and other middle eastern countries. The shock and fear, plus the lies, spurred enough public support to begin what President Bush called "a crusade." Recent investigative reports (e.g., Jeremy Scahill's, "Blackwater") have further illuminated this hidden agenda.

The largest US embassy in the world, located in Baghdad is referred to as "Crusader Castle." Erik Prince calls his Blackwater mercenaries "Crusaders for Christ." Prince and a Who's Who list of the wealthy and powerful (Neocon/Theocon/Religious Right) attend the secretive Council for National Policy started by Rev. Tim LaHaye, author of the apocalyptic Left Behind novels. While accepting an award from these folks, Watergate felon Charles Colson had this to say: "We're in a hundred-year war [against Islam] and it's time to sober up, and Christians understand it...and secular America doesn't get it." Then-head of Counterintelligence, CIA's J. Cofer Black, returned from White House meetings "inspired and talking in missionary terms." He also referred to "preparing the battlefield for World War Three." Joseph Schmitz, Inspector General of the Pentagon before resigning under fire, listed his membership in the Sovereign Military Order of Malta, whose mission was defending "territories that the crusaders had conquered from the Moslems." Military analyst William Arkin revealed the anti-Muslim rants delivered while in uniform by Lt. Gen. William Boykin and wrote: "Boykin is also in a senior Pentagon policymaking position, and it's a serious mistake to allow a man who believes in a Christian 'jihad' to hold such a job...and dangerous to have a senior officer guiding the war on terrorism...who believes...we are waging a holy war." Now presidential candidate John McCain is talking about a hundred years in Iraq. Are the Trillions of dollars missing from our US treasury funding this secret "holy war" against Islam?

Many loyal supporters of the secretive Bush regime are enraptured with apocalyptic fervor regarding "End Times" prophecies. This discredited 19th century concoction, so antithetical to the Gospel message that inspires peacemakers, is a growing concern. Like the infamous Protocol of the Elders of Zion, it's infectious to the unwary and has become popular and pernicious. For believers, the Twin Towers of 9/11 were the "towers of glass" whose destruction was foretold. That fulfillment of prophecy ignited Preacher John Hagee's Christians United for Israel (CUFI) to work toward yet another fulfillment of prophecy. They are feverishly "helping" the Jews position themselves for their predicted annihilation. The Hagee folks are pressuring the Bush regime to attack Iran with nuclear weapons. Do the insiders who accessed the anthrax spores (with impunity) from a US military base have similar access to nuclear material? Will they stage a nuclear attack this time and falsely blame it on Iran? Will people be fooled again into supporting a nuclear strike in retaliation? The most dangerous enemy is not out there. The enemy within is the most dangerous by far and it appears our own "religious" fanatics are possessed with the same inner violence and blind certainty that propels Islamic suicide bombers.

Will we allow this small minority to implement additional SELF-fulfilling prophecies of death and destruction while our heads remain buried in the sand? People of conscience, whether we call ourselves religious, spiritual, secular, or whatever, will have to unite and provide the grassroots pressure to stop this madness. Ralph Nader informs us that Democrats are afraid to impeach because if they do, the Bush regime will strike Iran, declare national emergency and stop the Fall elections. Perhaps the Democrats are a bit paranoid. If not, the situation is dire indeed. In either case real change is unlikely to occur with a change of party politicians. True leaders don't do it all for us but rather, they inspire us to initiate and live the changes we most deeply desire. I recall the words of M.L. King Jr. from April 4, 1967 the year I was drafted for the slaughter in Vietnam. I wasn't mature enough then to fully appreciate his wisdom and insight but now it's so clear and resounding: "there comes a time when silence is betrayal...we are at the moment when our lives must be placed on the line if our nation is to survive its own folly ... every [person] of humane convictions must decide on the protest that best suits [her]/his convictions, but we must all protest." United, we the people could relight the torch.

 

Re: pentagonfootage bogus?

This is absurd. No, the Crystal Palace was not constructed of wood. I'm not an idiot. Believe what you want, and I want hold it against you either. But I think I'll put my efforts into changing our government instead of sitting on my hands dreaming of the what ifs. I'm out.

 

Re: pentagonfootage bogus?

I've never heard of the "crystal palace fire".I
"ass-u-me(d)" a fire from the 1858 would involve a wooden structure
No one is calling anyone an idiot.
If I believed there were no other answers to these questions than "a deliberate conspiracy" ;I would be seriously negligent for not camping outside of my senators' office until the perpetrators were rounded up. You've just come on the board here, I want you to feel welcome, not run you off. So I'll settle with this:
(and not force a debate).

"I am full of crap".

Powerful word;,you dismissed a page of questions in 6 letters "ABSURD"...We'll leave it there; then. Though "absurd" doesn't address even a single question...

 

Re: pentagonfootage bogus?

Tango3,
It's been about a year now, and I'm back. I consider myself still young, immature, and stubborn, but not as much as I was a year ago. Over this time I have studied, researched, and grown. I have come to the conclusion that I am not as smart as I thought I was, and that I will no longer blindly believe without first asking questions. I never came back to read your last post till now. You were right to question, and I was wrong to hold beliefs without evidence. My eyes have been opened. I am now awake. I look forward to spending more time on this forum and learning all I can from other's experiences and views. Consider this an olive branch.

 

Re: pentagonfootage bogus?

WOW INDEED !!! Welcome back. Your opening post to this old thread made me sit back and widely open my eyes. What a breath of fresh air! TANGO3 you olde phart, put down the booze and respond to this nice lady. RIGHT NOW !!!

 

Re: pentagonfootage bogus?

Marvin Bush, owner of Secure Com did wiring on the building prior to the attacks.

 

Re: pentagonfootage bogus?

about the towers....some thing i never hear is about the wind speed around the top....it would make a difference...that being said i still feel something strange happened and our gov had something to do with it.

 

Re: pentagonfootage bogus?

USMCWife.....welcome back.....and....thank you.

 

Re: pentagonfootage bogus?

OzarkSaints--No, thank you and people like you for being on this forum and sharing your knowledge!

 

Re: pentagonfootage bogus?

The thing that bugs me the most about saying the Pentagon was an inside job is why? We'd already been attacked in New York, which if this were a false flag op would be more than enough. So why would we also attack the Pentagon? In fact, why hijack more than one plane? One collapsed building in New York leads to the war on terror, so why would we hijack four? And to think that we could possibly get hundreds if not thousands of people to pull off an op like this, and have no one come forward is ridiculous. And yes, I've done research. Read the articles, watched the videos, listened to theory upon theory. I understand that 9/11 was used to push through many onerous things, but I believe those were decisions made after the fact, not as part of a master plan. If we'd had a master plan, don't you think Iraq would have gone JUST a little bit smoother?

 

I don't know what happened. I just don't believe the government's side of the story. They let the Christmas Day underwear bomber on the plane. The "synagogue terrorists" have come out and stated that a federal agent paid them to plan a plot and supplied them with fake bombs. H1N1 was a deadly epidemic that was going to sweep America if we all didn't get vaccinated.

At this point, I don't trust a single thing that comes out of our government. As a matter of fact, I now look for evidence to the contrary. I would like one good explanation as to why we are still in Afghanistan and Iraq. When the conspiracy theories make more sense than the truth, then it is time to re-evaluate the truth. It's beginning to feel Orwellian around here. "War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength."

 

I'm only willing to take a stab at answering part of one question. Why are we still in Iraq and Afghanistan? We're still in Afghanistan because of Iraq. If we'd devoted the troops, time, enegy and money that went to Iraq to Afghanistan, my personal belief is that we'd be winding down our involvement there instead of ramping it up. I know we were lied to about WMD and Saddam's ties to 9/11, but again, I think that was the previous administration taking advantage of what happened. I don't believe anyone could or would actually run a false flag op on the scale of 9/11. Just my opinion, and I'm always willing to hear the other side.

 

I dont know what to think anymore....
So much deceit, lies, treachery...it never seems to end, only to grow like a cancer. I'm still working out flight 700, and the Oklahoma city disaster.
Too many unanswered questions for me....
Too many cover-ups and BS from what USED to be OUR government. people WE put in office by vote,...or do we?
See? It will never go away.
Once a conspiracy begins, it opens up a can of worms which can never be satisfied....
I know that WE have been lied to repeatedly.
With that, I have to make myself try to "accept" what I can, and put the rest into a deep dank and black space inside of me.
Lies only beget more lies until the truth gets lost in the quagmire.
We may NEVER know the real TRUTH about anything we have seen or been told.
Open and honest discussion may not get any of us very far...BUT, it's a start!

 

I'm fairly new here & probably missed the previous 9/11 posts. I happen to know a demo expert with Griffith Destruction. he takes down building & get's payed for it, where do I get that job. His crew helped out in the cleanup.
When asked about how he could take down one of the buildings he said it would take his crew about 6 months to prep for it. This is with a clear building, busting out wall & making a real mess. Think about doing it without anyone noticing. That was one building, not both.

 

Hey that's one of the benefits of accepting the "ye olde phart" without quibbling I get to keep "ye olde scotch"in the desk drawer with out embarrassment. I found a nice pm from "usmc wife" statingtheabove waiting for me upon return from my lengthy sabbatical and replied to it.

 

Since most of the theories posted here were simply stolen from Loose Change without really checking into much fact, I think I will reply with some unsubstantiated "fact" just to shake things up a bit.

First, I have just finished Loose Change and I have to say... wow. I can see how compelling it can be to simply watch something without checking into the facts and supporting evidence and bite it hook, line, and sinker. At a glance, without questioning the questioners.... it does appear to be orchestrated inside..... of course, Dylan Avery was out to write a fictional thriller about 9-11 being an inside job when he wrote Loose Change. Who would have ever thought that packaging it as fact would sell better..... oh wait.... that's been done before.

Truly why I can't bite is this- a fueled fire with jet fuel burns at some 550 degrees F. A typical house fire burns at 1100 degrees with no fuel. So, not only do you have fuel sloshing around lighting other accelerators (foam, plastic, etc), but you will achieve in a short time 1100 degrees which is the point of liquefying steel. Add to that the wind in a skyscraper.... anyone that has forged anything can see where I am going with this.... it's the perfect solution for metal failure. It's not hard to believe.

Now, packing thousands of pounds of explosives into a building occupied 24 hours a day..... that's plausible.

Anyways, in researching some of the claims in Loose Change, I found this blogger. He has a lot of good answers for a lot of the claims. When I watched Loose Change, I was open minded enough, but not to take it as fact. Neither, did I take the 9-11 Commission's Report as fact. There are still some unanswered questions there. My point is this- Making a handful of unsubstantiated claims in one film doesn't mean the other side's full account should be tossed. Here is the blogger's responses:

So, for this conspiracy to work as presented in the film, thousands of people would have to be figured in.... the eyewitnesses that saw the debris at the different sites, the thousands of emergency workers that responded, the thousands of eyewitnesses whose reports didn't jive with the 3 or 4 that CT's cling to. One positive in a sea of hundreds of thousands of negatives does not make a case. I don't think even Avery himself understands how big this would have to be. So, a conspiracy so big and important that the gov't would kill some 3K of it's own citizens.... and he ends with some barely tentative link between GWB's grandfather and some Fascist Conspiracy to overthrow Roosevelt (that's never been proven as well). Well, if the conspirators are so Fascist and the conspiracy so important.... why let Avery live? They just killed 3,000 innocent Americans. Why not go after the "true threat" to the conspirators?



I've done enough